Lyoto Machida's unanimous decision victory over Shogun Rua at UFC 104 has been the talk of the MMA world this week, because hardly anyone who watched the fight agreed with the three judges that Machida won it. Count Randy Couture among those who think Shogun deserved to win."I thought Shogun came out with an interesting game plan, stuck to it, and it proved to be pretty effective," Couture said Wednesday in an interview with FanHouse. "I thought his leg kicks controlled the tempo and did the most damage. I was surprised by the judges' decision -- I thought it went the other way -- but it was a great fight."
Couture said he'd stop short of the cries of "robbery" or "outrage" that some fans have expressed, but he said he scored it 49-46 for Shogun, and he had a hard time seeing the fight as 48-47 for Machida, which is how all three judges scored it.
"It was pretty close," Couture said. "Who knows what the judges are seeing? Robbed? I don't know about robbed. I thought it was four rounds to one for Shogun, but it was a very close fight and you just never know what the judges are looking at. Unfortunately, that's the fight game sometimes when it's that close."
Couture said he doesn't think the criteria of judging need to be overhauled, and he doesn't think MMA needs to get rid of the 10-point must scoring system. He just thinks MMA needs more judges who have more of an understanding of the sport.
"The scoring system is fine," Couture said. "Finding judges who know exactly what they're scoring, what they're looking at and what they're judging on is what we need. MMA is still so new that a lot of the judges are crossing over from other combative sports and don't have a lot of competitive background themselves, and it's hard to say what they're focused on and what they're looking at."
A full interview with Randy Couture, previewing his November 14 UFC 105 fight with Brandon Vera on Spike TV, will be coming in a couple weeks here at FanHouse.
Comments (Page 1 of 2)
And people say MDS is not biased towards Fedor and against Machida. Randy. I love you man. But you have taken too much beating in your last two fights. I guess you thought you won that fight against Nog too? It's OK my man. You are a terrible actor and all hype. But I respect you man
dude, seriously....if all your gonna do is talk nonsense then dont post. its gettin really, really old already
So me defending Machida is nonsense? I am not here to fight man. But all these guys are attacking Machida as they know they can't beat him. Rua has been beat before. Machida hasn't. He won the fight but guys like Rampage, Tito, Couture, everyone is attacking Machida. For one reason. They don't have the game to beat him.
It's no secret UFC wants Randy to challenge for the title and retire. He can't possibly beat Machida. Rua was beat by Forrest and Randy can do the same to him.
guy listen up...there is a big difference between these guys "attacking" machida and them jus stating their opinions. so randy has it 4-1 rua, how is that attacking machida, he is stating wat he thought the outcome shouldve been. idk maybe im missing something here but from wat ive read you post i think your jus looking to talk w/o thinking and its annoying.
any btw, im pretty sure anyone who watched the fight could now figure out some sort of a gameplan against machida....but thats jus my opinion
Norse - I totally agree. I've been arguing with him, but he spouts such total nonsense ... I'm going to stop.
Yeah same here. You can't use logic with an illogical psychophant.
Why am I even bothering with you guys? so you saw the fight 4-1 for Shogun. i saw it 3-2 for Machida. Silva saw it 5 -0 for Machida. Somehow your opinion and Couture's matter and everybody else who thinks Machida won is crazy. Get over your self. You are not the center of the universe. Fight was close. You saw it one way. I did another. Instead of attacking me, why don't you think about a better justification why Shogun lost, like he wasn't too aggressive.
Machida won. I saw it. the judges saw it. Anderson saw it. Josh Thompson saw it. We are not crazy brother. We are real MMA fans. You guys are fan boys. That's the difference.
I guess you mean by logic, i should just accept your bogus idea of who won that fight? So anyone who disagrees with you is illogical. Get over yourself sheeple.
this is all i am going to add. hard leg kicks pwns any jabs to the face. exp i don't know what fight you were watching but in all fairness randy is right, the leg kicks def controlled the fight.
@exp
You want it both ways. You want to say everyone who thinks Rua won is crazy and not a real MMA fan. You are the absolute biggest Machida fantard I've ever seen and thats saying something. You can't play the agressor and the victim all at the same time. Thats hypocritical. If all you had done is said you thought Machida won and given a reason as to why then it would have been left at that but you've taken it to a completely different level of hyperbole.
The fact of the matter is that it doesn't really matter because the fight is in the books. But, you can't even give Rua credit in the loss. Look at the stuff you've said about him simply because popular opinion is that he got robbed in that decision. Saying he is a bum, that people who thought he won are bitter Pride fans, racist, xenophobic, he didn't earn a title shot, Machida was sick and will knock him out next time etc etc. You've made yourself a complete ass because you are a butt hurt Machida fanboy who can't handle other people having a different opinion.
It's not enough that Shogun did more damage on Machida in 5 rounds than all of his last 5 fights combined. Your just a hateful, bitter sad excuse for an MMA fan. You aren't even a fan of MMA your just a fan of Lyoto and Silva. Then, you go and take all that misguided anger out on Fedor for some reason that still doesn't make sense as if anyone actually cares that much.
Perfect analogy is that you are the kid who thinks because he heard of a band first that everyone else is just posers. Your just a Machida psychophant and to top it off you aren't even consistent in your rhetoric. You bounce all over the place like a bi-polar chicken with it's head cut off.
Everything you say it hateful drivel filled with angst because people think Machida lost a fight. So, YOU need to get over it. Calling anyone who says they think Rua won that fight a fanboy or biased or racist or xenophobic and on and on it goes.
Get a grip on reality already. Try giving Shogun some credit and have a little humility for once in your life. Your like an annoying pimple on the crack of Fanhouse's backside.
As if the whole world is biased against Machida because they thought Rua won the fight. Hopefully you aren't really that stupid. If it's not just a pathetic attempt at trolling then you have much deeper issues to work out.
See things how they are and not how you'd like them to be.
I scored the fight the same way Randy Couture did: 4-1 for Shogun. I gave Shogun every round except round 3 which I still thought was pretty close.
I'm not sure how one of the judges gave Machida round 4 as that wasn't even close. I guess one could say that Machida definitvely won round 3 & Rua definitvely won rounds 4 & 5. So, the krux of the matter becomes the scoring of rounds 1 & 2.
I'm tired of talking about it over and over again but it's pretty telling that virtually everyone on message boards (literally 95% of respondents on bloddy elbow, fanhouse, cage potato and mma junkie), the fans in attendance (same fans that cheered Machida and chanted Machida) that booed the decision, to the fighters themselves (Anthony Johnson, Joe Stevenson, Randy Couture among others) and the UFC brass themselves (Dana White, Joe Rogan & Mike "the dummy" Goldberg) also said they scored the fight for Shogun.
At the end of the day it doesn't matter what people say or think because the three mens whose opinions mattered (the judges) all gave it to Machida. Public opinion is heavily in favor of Shogun (overwhelmingly so) Rua having won the fight which is why he will get a rematch right away. Hopefully there is more clarity in the eyes of the judges the second time around or maybe something definitive like a knockdown, knockout or submission.
However, I don't want the judges for their second fight to let the first have any bearing on their scoring. It'd be pretty terrible if Shogun won an equally dominating performance by Machida like we saw Saturday.
okay exp you really need to stop talking. You talk about how you are a 'real mma fan'.... you remind me of those people in junior high and elementary that jsut because they heard a song first that means they were the only ones allowed to like it or the real fans. so please stop. In addition to your nonsense, i am an mma fighter and i also saw the fight 4-1. You think just because big names like thompson and anderson silva who is lyotos friend are trying to justify his win? And you are saying you are not crazy... implying that the rest of the people who saw the fight and think shogun won are? I don't see your logic because lyoto machidas boss even said shogun won, joe rogan said shogun won, mike goldberg said shogun won, couture said shogun won, anthony johnson, joe steven and the majority of the fans in L.A watching those fights that night believe Rua won. So don't play this name game with all of us because there are far more people who saw shogun winning. Also, MMAjunkie, yahoo sports, mmafanhouse, fiveouncesofpain, and every sports analysts/site gave it to Rua. soooo please stop posting your nonsense, oh and you might want to go back to grade 4 to take some grammer classes. :P
Fight was fix Dana White!!!!!!!
Fight was fixed Dana White Bull ShYt it wasnt. I just want to know who was betting on it.
And I also think Forest was druged or something because he didnt look right at the beginning of the fight something is up.
People, this is a new sport with a lot of loop holes, in boxing there were a lot of cheaters, an in this sport there is too. If they dont find cheaters there not doing a good job in policing the sport.
Who gives a bleep if they caught a guy doing steriods, that not what im talking about, im talking about fights getting fixed, bigger than steriods.
Machida lost that fight, the judges were paid off!!!!!!!!!!!
Machida won. Quit crying like long winded little B I T C H E S!!!
Machida himself can't even say he won. SO STFU!
1st Rd Machida 10-9
2nd rd Draw 10-10 (if you want give it to Machida)
3rd Rd Rua 10-9 machida had a late flurry but only landed 2-3 glancing blows while Shogun landed a power shot and overall Shogun landed more in this round)
4th Rd Rua 10-9
5th Rd Rua 10-9
Even with giving the 2nd rd to Machida he still loses becuase IF YOU WATCH THE FIGHT AGAIN WHILE BEING SOBER AND MOVING MACHIDAS PUBIC HAIRS OUT OF THE WAY YOU CAN SEE THAT HIS STRIKES WERE HARDLY EVER LANDING AND DID NO DAMAGE UNLIKE SHOGUNS! THIS WAS THE WORST ROBBERY EVER!!!
I am with Guitar God. The voice of reason on this forum. The top analyst here has sold out. The sheeple fans have already mastered Rogan's lines. Machida won the first 3 rounds. End of the story. I know you have the desire to say something that makes you smart among the sheeple but that doens't change the fact that Machida won. If you think Shogun won, I have a bridge on mars to sell you brother. I am sure you'll like it. Wake up sheeple
i had shogun winning 4 out of 5 rounds, first, second, forth and fifth. it's not entirely unreasonable to call it 3-2 shogun, but definitely arguementive. from what i saw, shogun was the dominate fighter. he pressed the action, controlled the pace, and landed more shots, and did more damage with the shots he landed.
i would like to hear what reasoning is used for machida winning; he landed less shots, those landed were basically ineffective in stopping shogun agression, and he was back peddeling most of the fight.
that was a horrible call by three judges. how can all 3 get it so wrong? the judging really stinks and theres little plausable explaination except deliberate corruption. thats not a first reaction, but i dont know how else they saw the fight 4-1 machida.
This in my opinion was one of the worst decisions ever in mma.
I think Shogun clearly won that fight and it seems the Machida backers just can't bring themselves to admit it.
Stupid excuses like Rogan influenced everyone are juvenile at best. Rogan's call was almost perfect he actually called the fight as it played out. He gave Machida credit the few times he earned it, and other times that people say Machida went high and Shogun went low and got the credit was deserved as well. Simply Machida either missed the majority of his high strikes or they were blocked.
The end of the third round Machida missed almost every single strike in his flurry and was clocked with a big right hand at the end.
Others use the feeble excuse that to be the champ you have to beat the champ. What does that actually mean? Shogun did beat him and if we follow your logic Sylvia was robbed against Couture because he was still standing after five rounds in that fight.
The more you guys try to defend this decision, the more you show that you are closed minded and blind followers on the Machida bandwagon.
Machida showed no ability to hurt Shogun and he still fought his fight and lost. Watch the next fight, Shogun will come up with an even better game plan and he'll ko Machida. I wonder what your excuses are going to be then?
okay guys,
i really need some clarification here......
this goes out to everybody......johnny, niv, richard, shorty, exp, eric, guitar god, claytor, etc...
i'm really having a tough time here arguing over who won because imo, the fight to me, to me, sucked.
no real engagement by either fighter, just a pic and paw and dance and a few kicks.
82 total strikes by rua and 42 total by machida.
if i had to pick a winner i would have given it to rua, only because less than 10 strikes landed per round on average is lame.
rua might have deserved a decision, but did he really look like he went out and took the title?
to me, hardly.
i realize some of you were watching it, expecting ko one way or the other. and were then happy to watch a purely tactical fight put on, mainly by rua.
to me with that little of action, especially considering that the fight was stand up the whole way, it seemed neither wanted to go after...possibly commit to attack, yet they both feared each others counters too much.
i'm sure many hardcores appreciated rua doing what he had to do to win and then feel he was robbed because he didn't get the decision.
i looked at it with total apathy and when the decision was announced i really just didn't care.
and i was totally jacked beforehand.
if someone can defend the last 45 seconds of round 4 where neither threw a punch or kick,
please, i'm begging let me hear it.
once again, i'll use the shannon briggs example.
imo shannon briggs could have been one of the best hw's of all time, the guy was an absolute monster....6'4" 270lbs and yet in his final couple of fights he threw like 8 punches a round.
that's the way i saw this fight.
did it look like rua went out and took the title?
did it look like machida in his first defense of proved he was a deserving champ?
no to both.
neither deserved it.
if you really think the ufc wants these types of fights, then why did they get rid of thales lietes?
to johnny, i know you liked the fight because you saw it as, "yeah thats the way to beat machida".
and maybe if the fight were to go on another 4-5 rounds rua would have been able to finally take machida down and then win decisively.
i'd rather see a fight where guys look like they want to fight. in this fight they both looked like what can i do to not get hurt.
to me they both seemed too afraid of each other.
i don't know, maybe i'm being too joe public here.
I understand what you're saying, and I think that most of the "Rua was robbed" cries will die down and give way to "it was a close fight ... I guess I can live with the decision".
The decision was a poor one IMO, but it definitely wasn't an absolutely terrible one. The 10 point must system has no place in MMA, but that's another topic entirely and unfortunately we are stuck with it.
My problem is - Rua developed a game plan to beat Machida ... ok, maybe it wasn't the most exciting gameplan, but in my mind and the minds of many he won. Going out there to "take the title from Machida" might have been the wrong approach.
@Neo
I think Rua just out Machida'd Machida.
He fought smart and did what no one else had been able to do in the UFC against Lyoto.